janstett
Oct 23, 11:44 AM
Unfortunately not many multithreaded apps - yet. For a long time most of the multi-threaded apps were just a select few pro level things. 3D/Visualization software, CAD, database systems, etc.. Those of us who had multiprocessor systems bought them because we had a specific software in mind or group of software applications that could take advantage of multiple processors. As current CPU manufacturing processes started hitting a wall right around the 3GHz mark, chip makers started to transition to multiple CPU cores to boost power - makes sense. Software developers have been lazy for years, just riding the wave of ever-increasing MHz. Now the multi-core CPUs are here and the software is behind as many applications need to have serious re-writes done in order to take advantage of multiple processors. Intel tried to get a jump on this with their HT (Hyper Threading) implementation that essentially simulated dual-cores on a CPU by way of two virtual CPUs. Software developers didn't exactly jump on this and warm up to it. But I also don't think the software industry truly believed that CPUs would go multi-core on a mass scale so fast... Intel and AMD both said they would, don't know why the software industry doubted. Intel and AMD are uncommonly good about telling the truth about upcoming products. Both will be shipping quad-core CPU offerings by year's end.
What you're saying isn't entirely true and may give some people the wrong idea.
First, a multicore system is helpful when running multiple CPU-intensive single-threaded applications on a proper multitasking operating system. For example, right now I'm ripping CDs on iTunes. One processor gets used a lot and the other three are idle. I could be using this CPU power for another app.
The reality is that to take advantage of multiple cores, you had to take advantage of threads. Now, I was doing this in my programs with OS/2 back in 1992. I've been writing multithreaded apps my entire career. But writing a threaded application requires thought and work, so naturally many programmers are lazy and avoid threads. Plus it is harder to debug and synchronize a multithreaded application. Windows and Linux people have been doing this since the stone age, and Windows/Linux have had usable multiprocessor systems for more than a decade (it didn't start with Hyperthreading). I had a dual-processor 486 running NT 3.5 circa 1995. It's just been more of an optional "cool trick" to write threaded applications that the timid programmer avoids. Also it's worth noting that it's possible to go overboard with excessive threading and that leads to problems (context switching, thrashing, synchronization, etc).
Now, on the Mac side, OS 9 and below couldn't properly support SMP and it required a hacked version of the OS and a special version of the application. So the history of the Mac world has been, until recently with OSX, to avoid threading and multiprocessing unless specially called for and then at great pain to do so.
So it goes back to getting developers to write threaded applications. Now that we're getting to 4 and 8 core systems, it also presents a problem.
The classic reason to create a thread is to prevent the GUI from locking up while processing. Let's say I write a GUI program that has a calculation that takes 20 seconds. If I do it the lazy way, the GUI will lock up for 20 seconds because it can't process window messages during that time. If I write a thread, the calculation can take place there and leave the GUI thread able to process messages and keep the application alive, and then signal the other thread when it's done.
But now with more than 4 or 8 cores, the problem is how do you break up the work? 9 women can't have a baby in a month. So if your process is still serialized, you still have to wait with 1 processor doing all the work and the others sitting idle. For example, if you encode a video, it is a very serialized process. I hear some work has been done to simultaneously encode macroblocks in parallel, but getting 8 processors to chew on a single video is an interesting problem.
What you're saying isn't entirely true and may give some people the wrong idea.
First, a multicore system is helpful when running multiple CPU-intensive single-threaded applications on a proper multitasking operating system. For example, right now I'm ripping CDs on iTunes. One processor gets used a lot and the other three are idle. I could be using this CPU power for another app.
The reality is that to take advantage of multiple cores, you had to take advantage of threads. Now, I was doing this in my programs with OS/2 back in 1992. I've been writing multithreaded apps my entire career. But writing a threaded application requires thought and work, so naturally many programmers are lazy and avoid threads. Plus it is harder to debug and synchronize a multithreaded application. Windows and Linux people have been doing this since the stone age, and Windows/Linux have had usable multiprocessor systems for more than a decade (it didn't start with Hyperthreading). I had a dual-processor 486 running NT 3.5 circa 1995. It's just been more of an optional "cool trick" to write threaded applications that the timid programmer avoids. Also it's worth noting that it's possible to go overboard with excessive threading and that leads to problems (context switching, thrashing, synchronization, etc).
Now, on the Mac side, OS 9 and below couldn't properly support SMP and it required a hacked version of the OS and a special version of the application. So the history of the Mac world has been, until recently with OSX, to avoid threading and multiprocessing unless specially called for and then at great pain to do so.
So it goes back to getting developers to write threaded applications. Now that we're getting to 4 and 8 core systems, it also presents a problem.
The classic reason to create a thread is to prevent the GUI from locking up while processing. Let's say I write a GUI program that has a calculation that takes 20 seconds. If I do it the lazy way, the GUI will lock up for 20 seconds because it can't process window messages during that time. If I write a thread, the calculation can take place there and leave the GUI thread able to process messages and keep the application alive, and then signal the other thread when it's done.
But now with more than 4 or 8 cores, the problem is how do you break up the work? 9 women can't have a baby in a month. So if your process is still serialized, you still have to wait with 1 processor doing all the work and the others sitting idle. For example, if you encode a video, it is a very serialized process. I hear some work has been done to simultaneously encode macroblocks in parallel, but getting 8 processors to chew on a single video is an interesting problem.
NoSmokingBandit
Dec 6, 02:50 PM
I'm letting my B-Spec driver earn me some cash. He is so slow..... He is only Lvl3 right now, but i'm really impatient!
I got the Lotus Top Gear race done today. Took me a whole hour. About 40 minutes in i got pissed and turned ABS all the way up and ASM on. It helped so much, but the AI made it difficult to finsh. They'd ram into me and i'd get a dsq. Pissed me off.
If anyone is having trouble, try turning off TCS completely, ABS all the way up, ASM on, and the front brake bias to 10. It makes up for the awful tires they put on it.
I accepted littleman and psychofetus as friends, so if either of you want to trade cars let me know what you are looking for.
I got the Lotus Top Gear race done today. Took me a whole hour. About 40 minutes in i got pissed and turned ABS all the way up and ASM on. It helped so much, but the AI made it difficult to finsh. They'd ram into me and i'd get a dsq. Pissed me off.
If anyone is having trouble, try turning off TCS completely, ABS all the way up, ASM on, and the front brake bias to 10. It makes up for the awful tires they put on it.
I accepted littleman and psychofetus as friends, so if either of you want to trade cars let me know what you are looking for.
BornAgainMac
Aug 17, 09:19 AM
Won't Adobe use Core Image when the Universal Binaries come out? If both Quads had the same high powered graphics card, the benchmarks may show them to be the same with Core Image tasks.
~Shard~
Jul 15, 12:58 AM
It would be ridiculous if it came with just 512 mb's of ram...
Steve Jobs-"The New Octa-Core Mac Pro with 512 mb's of ram" It just doesn't fit...
I agree, it wouldn't make sense. Might as well sell a new Lamborghini with a 1.8L 4-banger... ;)
Steve Jobs-"The New Octa-Core Mac Pro with 512 mb's of ram" It just doesn't fit...
I agree, it wouldn't make sense. Might as well sell a new Lamborghini with a 1.8L 4-banger... ;)
zoran
Oct 15, 02:55 PM
... hmmm ... i just ordered a mac pro quad 3ghz ... 8 cores would be somehow nicer ;)
.a
cancel the order while its not too late! :)
.a
cancel the order while its not too late! :)
majorp
Sep 19, 05:08 AM
Im still on for today, 4 hours and counting.
aafuss1
Aug 6, 10:20 PM
Jhonen Vasquez-would be a great guest at a Apple keynote, when Steve does a update on TV shows-like WWDC or a iPod event.
triceretops
Apr 27, 09:13 AM
And assume you go to a place you have been a month ago, wouldn't having the database speed things up when you return to that location a month later?
(Though I agree the effect will be very minor, as soon as you land with a plane, the iPhone will start populating that database, thus having the data from a month ago will only be relevant if you need location data right away after landing.)
How else are you going to check in on Facebook?:p
My layover at some airports is only 45 minutes.
(Though I agree the effect will be very minor, as soon as you land with a plane, the iPhone will start populating that database, thus having the data from a month ago will only be relevant if you need location data right away after landing.)
How else are you going to check in on Facebook?:p
My layover at some airports is only 45 minutes.
KnightWRX
Apr 20, 12:06 PM
Not as a separate thing. It's the grid IN COMBINATION with the other things that constitutes the trade dress.
Then it sure doesn't apply to all models then if the trade dress claim is an AND'd combination. Is the trade dress claim only applicable to certain models in the ones listed in the complaint ?
Then it sure doesn't apply to all models then if the trade dress claim is an AND'd combination. Is the trade dress claim only applicable to certain models in the ones listed in the complaint ?
Orange-DE
Jul 31, 11:04 AM
You Do Dat!
BeefUK
Aug 27, 05:40 AM
Just looked at the shpping dates for the Core 2 Duo's listed on the dell site. There's an estimated shipping date of 11th September, so maybe the 5th is a more releastic release date for Apple's merom upgrade, whatever form it may come in.
Recently Apple's made new products avaliable to buy immediately they are announced. So looks like a little more waiting.
I'm hoping for a Macbook with Core 2 Duo 2GHz!!
Recently Apple's made new products avaliable to buy immediately they are announced. So looks like a little more waiting.
I'm hoping for a Macbook with Core 2 Duo 2GHz!!
jclardy
Mar 26, 11:14 AM
This. Until this happens displays won't advance any further for actual computers (non-tablet) because there are so many form factors.
Apple can spend the time to make graphics for each flavor of iPhone or iPad because there aren't that many to deal with. It becomes a lot more difficult to do this across a large range of products. Besides, computers are getting to the point where they are too powerful for most users (hence the popularity of the iPad). A retina display option would give people more incentive to upgrade their desktops, laptops, etc. I think?
As a designer, I'd love a retina 27" ACD. 300dpi right on my screen, almost perfect. Now if we could just get the color/brightness a little more accurate...
I really don't see the point of a display anywhere near 300DPI for a desktop or laptop. My MBP 15" with the 1680x1050 display has a DPI of 128, and with this I can only see the pixels of the fonts if my face is 6" away from the screen, which is above the keyboard. If you have a monitor on a desk it is going to be at least a foot away, but probably more like 1.5-2 feet.
Some of Apples displays are still around 90-100 DPI which I could see upgrading from those to around 150 or so. The main reason they aren't doing it right now is because the menu bar and all other interface elements would be tiny. On my MBP they are already pretty small along with all the default fonts and that is only at 128DPI.
So some kind of resolution independence is necessary, I am hoping for a general fix and not just a retina display fix (2x) because there will be no in between. With a general fix they could implement a slider that allows you to resize everything to fit any resolution.
But back on topic, I am pretty surprised if this is true. I guess they are pushing for a summer release, but I guess they could be pretty much feature complete by now and just need to work out bugs.
Apple can spend the time to make graphics for each flavor of iPhone or iPad because there aren't that many to deal with. It becomes a lot more difficult to do this across a large range of products. Besides, computers are getting to the point where they are too powerful for most users (hence the popularity of the iPad). A retina display option would give people more incentive to upgrade their desktops, laptops, etc. I think?
As a designer, I'd love a retina 27" ACD. 300dpi right on my screen, almost perfect. Now if we could just get the color/brightness a little more accurate...
I really don't see the point of a display anywhere near 300DPI for a desktop or laptop. My MBP 15" with the 1680x1050 display has a DPI of 128, and with this I can only see the pixels of the fonts if my face is 6" away from the screen, which is above the keyboard. If you have a monitor on a desk it is going to be at least a foot away, but probably more like 1.5-2 feet.
Some of Apples displays are still around 90-100 DPI which I could see upgrading from those to around 150 or so. The main reason they aren't doing it right now is because the menu bar and all other interface elements would be tiny. On my MBP they are already pretty small along with all the default fonts and that is only at 128DPI.
So some kind of resolution independence is necessary, I am hoping for a general fix and not just a retina display fix (2x) because there will be no in between. With a general fix they could implement a slider that allows you to resize everything to fit any resolution.
But back on topic, I am pretty surprised if this is true. I guess they are pushing for a summer release, but I guess they could be pretty much feature complete by now and just need to work out bugs.
arkmannj
Aug 5, 08:09 PM
I am excited for 10.5, mac pros, displays, core 2 duo, etc...
but for the practicle side of my wallet I feel like I've been waiting FOREVER for an airport upgrade. (as in, an upgrade to the airport extreme, express) I'm not expecting faster speeds, but it would be very nice if they could add features like
* the ability for USB 2.0 / firewire external storage devices to connect, or even like 2GB built in storage for shared files.
* streaming video
* etc :-)
but for the practicle side of my wallet I feel like I've been waiting FOREVER for an airport upgrade. (as in, an upgrade to the airport extreme, express) I'm not expecting faster speeds, but it would be very nice if they could add features like
* the ability for USB 2.0 / firewire external storage devices to connect, or even like 2GB built in storage for shared files.
* streaming video
* etc :-)
NoSmokingBandit
Aug 18, 10:37 PM
I hate how some people think the ~800 standard cars are going to look like GT4 cars. Obviously they wont, because even at half the poly density of the premium cars they would still look gorgeous.
Meh, haters gonna hate as the kids say.
I just hope the it has a 2008 cobalt in the game. My friend claims the focus is one of the worst cars ever made but he drives a cobalt :rolleyes: So i want to pit them against each other on a track.
Meh, haters gonna hate as the kids say.
I just hope the it has a 2008 cobalt in the game. My friend claims the focus is one of the worst cars ever made but he drives a cobalt :rolleyes: So i want to pit them against each other on a track.
JDawg76
Jul 20, 12:53 PM
Anyone on here agree that we are entering the world of PC's of sh*ot in the way where we buy a Mac and 2 months later there's news of something better down the road? Or is this just for now since this is the transition period for Apple to the Intel chips. Just curious.
naco
Apr 8, 01:20 AM
What happened wasn't something Bestbuy corporate said to do. It was something each stores individual manager decided to do. Why? Who knows.
Most BestBuy stores who have a SWAS (Store within a store) Apple Store also have a representative from Apple manning the area. This Rep. sells their product and has knowledge on inventory. I would imagine that their improvement rate depends on how much Apple product is sold through their location. Possibly how this got back to Apple....
Most BestBuy stores who have a SWAS (Store within a store) Apple Store also have a representative from Apple manning the area. This Rep. sells their product and has knowledge on inventory. I would imagine that their improvement rate depends on how much Apple product is sold through their location. Possibly how this got back to Apple....
runninmac
Aug 17, 01:01 AM
This is a very dumb question but is Photoshop running under rosetta in this test?
If Photoshop is that is nuts.
Oh, please believe it is.
:eek:
If Photoshop is that is nuts.
Oh, please believe it is.
:eek:
brianus
Sep 13, 10:05 AM
probably due to latency involved in distributing the load across the two processors. that's the same problem a single Clovertown would have. Only true quads wouldn't suffer from these problems (earliest seems to be Harpertown in don't know if there are any non-MCM Xeons scheduled before then)
What about Tigerton (2007)? Isn't that a "true" quad?
What about Tigerton (2007)? Isn't that a "true" quad?
Bill McEnaney
Mar 7, 07:21 AM
I won't rejoin this discussion. But since neko girl may be waiting for my reply, I'll only suggest a source (http://www.tfp.org/images/books/Defending_A_Higher_Law.pdf).
Alx9876
Apr 6, 01:27 PM
What a joke of a tablet. Nothing but a piece of crap.
fraserdrew
Aug 6, 01:02 PM
I have tried the vista Beta, and ran in via BootCamp, so no different hardware. Tiger is miles ahead of vista.
Put simply: Tiger Works.... Vista Crashes and takes 2 years longer than tiger to do the same task.
I don't care how it looks, i don't care about see-through windows. I want something that works. Tiger gives me that.... and i hope leopard makes it even better. Tiger is ahead of the competition, hopefully leopard will be further forward, beating Vista to where it should be... In a beige, boring box:D
Put simply: Tiger Works.... Vista Crashes and takes 2 years longer than tiger to do the same task.
I don't care how it looks, i don't care about see-through windows. I want something that works. Tiger gives me that.... and i hope leopard makes it even better. Tiger is ahead of the competition, hopefully leopard will be further forward, beating Vista to where it should be... In a beige, boring box:D
dudemac
Aug 7, 04:05 PM
Features I want:
-iChat screen sharing (awesome idea!) and video effects
-Spaces (finally a Apple OS-level implementation)
-Time Machine (I want a friggin wormhole on my computer!)
I wish they'd show us the Top Secret features.
But seriously, so one even saw Time Machine coming. That was a surprise!
-iChat screen sharing (awesome idea!) and video effects
-Spaces (finally a Apple OS-level implementation)
-Time Machine (I want a friggin wormhole on my computer!)
I wish they'd show us the Top Secret features.
But seriously, so one even saw Time Machine coming. That was a surprise!
stapler
Sep 13, 07:57 PM
I doubt anybody runs more than eight really hardcore apps at once.
jessica.
Mar 17, 10:34 AM
Who is this "you" that you speak of? I didn't vote for Obama. :rolleyes:
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